Tigrim's Guardian Guide

Greetings fellow guardians,

but also those from other classes who like to learn more about our work.

This shall be an essay about what I learnt about the duties, abilities and other specials of the work as a guardian. It will also outline a few example setups that have proven to work well, aswell as hints regarding teamwork.

Though, since despite myself being experienced in what I do, I currently am writing this from the view of level 32 and do not know much about the skills beyond that. If there's anything noteworthy to add, I ask any older guardians to throw in a comment.

Please note that this is a first draft I made, but I like comments and shall overhaul it as needed.

1.) The basics - What is a guardian about ?

The easiest answer to this, if you are a guardian, then just have a look at your youth and what was tought to you. You will find something that makes us special... we have learnt to use heavy shields !

Now you may ask what's so special about that, since some other classes can use - lighter - shields too. Well, our heavy shields of course provide a huge amount of protection, which combined with using heavy armor makes us as sturdy as no other class can ever dream of being. In addition, if you put a bit of effort into your training, you will soon learn great skills and traits that'll allow using the shield with even further efficiency.

Obviously this leads to making us the man upfront the enemy, right in the middle of the action to keep whatever danger or number of enemies from our less durable friends. We are made to stand where others fall, but this also results in a responsibility to prevent our friends from getting harmed.

Of course, all the protection from armor, shield and skills/trais leads to a few drawbacks, e.g. we have almost no range attack and don't deal much damage really. Our strength lies in outlasting any amount of enemies while being under heavy attack, slowly decimating them one by one.

Sounds too risky ? Then this job isn't for you. There's no place for cowards amongst guardians, and we are proud of that.

Sounds too easy ? All the armor protection might look easy. Sadly it isn't, as you will learn further down. Though, know this already: If you don't focus on certain aspects of the guardian class but think you can do them all, you might fail the task that lies upon our shoulders.

2.) General Guide

Race
While it might sound funny to some of the big folks, us short dwarves usually make up the sturdiest guardians due to a natural damage reduction and race traits that support the guardian's task. But then, this is a pretty common combination and isn't really special therefore - actually any rather odd combination like e.g. elf+guardian will allow for a much more special RP.

Traits
Whatever traits you chose, you might like to have a look at equipping same-type traits, since you then can get so-called line bonuses that you otherwise would miss out on.

Since shield using is my style, my decision for a trait line is made, and I get all the various bonuses from the trait line. Yet, I will not advise any traits to fellow guardians since it not only is a matter of taste but also of deeds you fullfilled. Take what you like but don't forget about line bonuses.

Stances
To enhance your blocking or parrying chances (depending if you are using 1h- or 2h- weapon) until next death/day, use one of the stances. Don't forget to enable it after logon (preferrably right when you enable your ressource scanner)!

Guardian's Ward
This skill is your best friend. Raising your blocking/parry and chances for counter attacks significiantly, you shall make sure to use this as often as possible. It is a good combat opener and needs to be used again after each 10secs.

Guardian's Pledge
You get this skill in the 20s about and shall use it for major boss battles or emergency running only (except for training) since it has a rather long cooldown. Make sure to not use it at the very beginning of the battle but rather when e.g. at half health, since you can nicely regenerate health while this special lasts - sadly only 15secs.

Archery
At the 30th level us guardian receive a limited ability to use bow and crossbow. Sounds too good to be true ? Nah, it isn't really. It just saves us some running towards the baddies and allows you to shoot one and make a group come here. Don't think you are Legolas, now that you are allowed to wield a bow - considering that we have no auto-shooting, there's a several seconds delay between using the shooting ability and the fact that each shot costs a considerable amount of power, we plainly suck at using them. Yet, a useful tool in certain situations, e.g. to pull a certain mob safely without attracting too many near it.

3.) Solo Guide
Not much to say for soloing really. Using a 2-hander for extra damage or a 1-hander plus shield for extra protection usually is a matter of taste and targets. Big two-handers surely are the choice versus lesser foes when you roam in areas you left behind a while ago. Here's a short list of pro's and con's:

1-hander with shield
+ relative safety versus strong mobs or groups
+ alot less damage taken (shield block plus extra armor rating)
+ stun ability after blocking
+ trait to regain power after blocking
+ shield bash as secondary attack
+ less "downtime" for regeneration after battle
+ less repair costs
+ the way to go for teamwork and boss tanking
- inefficient versus crowds of lesser mobs

2-hander
+ highly efficient versus crowds of lesser mobs, e.g. when farming
+ slightly higher average damage (yes, it's not much more really!)
+ considerably less power consumption
- requires purchase of an extra 2h-weapon once a while
- comparably high repair costs due to reduced protection
- dangerous versus crowds of strong mobs

Myself, I found the damage difference insignificant and stick to a 1-hander with shield usually, especially since I prefer to fight mobs of at least my own level. For my needs, I find the benefits of 1-hander use outweighting the benefits of a 2-hander easily. I am not the one who farms lesser mobs much, so for that purpose I still would consider a 2-hander and even buy one once a while if I get one cheaply (sometimes without ever using it really!).

4.) Teamwork Guide

Team Constellation
As guardian in a group, it seems natural that you use a shield and no two-handed weapon, afterall it is this huge shield that makes us special and why people like to see us at the front. It is obvious that we will require at least one of the team members to be able to heal. Your sturdy armor and strong blocking ability will usually reduce damage which saves the healer alot of power and reduces the healing needs for standard tasks alot. Thus, it's not always needed to have a lute-swinging minstrel with you, but instead a skilled captain or lore-master can do aswell. Actually, one of my favorite duo-team classes is the captain who can heal enough and also off-tank lesser critters.

Pulling & Aggro Management
Generally in a group, the job of a guardian implies that it is you who rushes into the mobs and tries to attract as many of them as possible so they will not bother the weaklings behind you. This is especially needed for elite boss targets, which must be bound by the guardian. Other warrior types can then one by one pick on the lesser non-boss mobs aswell as whatever dares to go past you e.g. straight to your healer, despite your efforts of keep them at bay. And of course, the healer is your life-insurance just as you are his/her.

Make sure that you always watch out for mobs that escape you, and if anything is near your healer but no other friend there to handle it, get him off there no matter what. Remember: A dead healer usually also means a dead guardian too. So, save yourself by saving your healer, if nobody else does (which they really should).

It is mandatory that us guardians do the pulling, else we might not be able to fetch a mob off a "softer" friend (after he did wrongly pull), which keeps the healer wasting mana on that friend who takes lots of damage through his weaker armor. Especially younger and hot-minded hunters are known to do the first shot - ask them to stop, else they'll die by own fault, or, if all goes even worse, all the group is in danger.

Your Performance
Do you remember me stating that being a guardian isn't made for cowards ? Okay, since you read up to here, I assume that you don't consider yourself one.

For a guardian there is no "too many enemies" - there's only "too little healing", which implies that you must have 100% faith into your group's healer. While it seems risky, many enemies will allow for your blocking and parrying abilites to shine, and you will be able to use one special attack chain after another, while (with the proper trait) each shield blocking regains your power to fund them. These special attacks often attack multiple enemies near you, if not all, thus making them even more angry at you - and... that's right our job: A mob that's angry at you is a nice mob. 'Cause it doesn't hurt the softies in the group, who shall care for the lesser mobs while you handle the big bosses and as many mobs in addition as you can get.

In short: More enemies mean more overall efficiency of a guardian's special attacks not only damage wise but especially for the creation of aggro. Of course, there's limits... you shall keep an eye on your healer's power reserves, and maybe before battle already have a plan about a group retreat if needed.

5.) Your Attributes

• Might - this without doubt is your best friend. Yes some use it to increase the damage you deal, but that's not the point: We use it to increase our block chance. More blocking means more special attack chains which make us powerful. And of course, blocking means we don't receive damage - afterall even us guardians ain't suicidal, ain't we ?
  
  
• Vitality - Now, alot of morale makes a man live longer. Or a dwarf. Oh yes, and elves and hobbits too. Guess it is more than obvious that this one is needed alot, afterall it's us guardians who are supposed to take the beating. Though, don't overvalue Vitality, it's more important to avoid damage by blocking than being able to take a hit more (see might).
  
  
• Fate - Myself, I found the regeneration bonuses from the fate attribute too little and decided to neglect it mostly. There's other ways to regenerate that have shown to be way more efficient.
  
  
• Will - Here goes about the same as for Fate, I would say.
  
  
• Agility - eh.. what's that I should ask ? Seriously, you don't need it and you don't want it either really. We don't need the critical hit bonuses since we're not made to deal damage. And we don't want to evade blows anyways, 'cause most of our special attacks are of the retaliating nature, which means we need to block or parry alot to work efficiently. Just forget this attribute, it doesn't exist, okay ?
  
  
• Regeneration - Uh.. this is an attribute now ? Yep it indirectly is. The fate/will character attributes provide regeneration, but also equipment attributes can have regeneration. I favor regeneration items over fate/will since it seems stronger to me*. Just be aware that you don't need too much power regeneration for there's a trait that regenerates power upon blocking a hit. Actually, I personally rate in-combat morale regeneration above anything else, especially for solo hunting where you lack a healer.
  
  I just recently learnt that a whole 54 fate equals 1.0 in-combat regeneration for morale and power, plus some non-guardian-relevant bonuses. This seems a bit much fate required to receive any useful amount of regeneration, so you best stick to might/vitality items along with regeneration as you feel required. And if you only do group tanking and always have a reliable healer with you, you might even consider to totally forget about regeneration.
  

Keep in mind that to reach the maximum might and vitality, it often is required to not use the strongest armor available but rather one with the best attribute bonuses.

6.) Example Setups
Standard Guardian
Most guardians focus plainly on armor, might and vitality, maybe some fate. This surely is a straight setup and will usually do nicely. The lack in the regeneration department makes you somewhat reliable on a proper healer though, so this is probably not recommended at young ages where many healers don't know their job well.

Tigrim's Regeneration Setup
My personal preference is the in-combat regeneration. Afterall it is right during battle when I need it while there's no healer around, especially since a guardian has no great skill to heal. Combined with your defensive skills (Guardian's Pledge, Blocking, Parrying) and reduced damage due to sturdy armor and shield, this allows to last alot longer in battle. (I also am proud owner of a most lucky find, a weapon that allows a special great healing once a while - helpful in emergencies but surely rare). I am all into shield traits, which e.g. increase my power when I block, provide alot of extra armor and might, etc. Like this I can do solo hunting very well, and somewhat compensate the mistakes of a healer in a group (yep, at my level this is pretty normal!). In an experienced group this setup reduces the load from the healer alot, since I am the main target to heal usually, thus a comment I often hear from minstrels when asking how it goes is "Eh.. I hadn't much to do.". The inherited lack of damage output within my most defensive setup I usually compensated by using a proper purple close-to-my-level weapon.

Nice job - great guide, Tigrim!

I'll add only few words from myself.

Guardians are really toughest class in LOTRO.

These protectors of the weak are trying to get enemies attention to give others time to prepare deadly attack or to prepare run to save their lives.

Strong armour, heavy shields and good onehanded weapons are the heart of any fellowship. What would they do without a good guardian saving their asses from even worst looking situation?

Although guardians rely on their armour and heavy shields, sometimes you can find them wandering around with greatsword, twohanded axe, mallet or a big club. Their natural damage resistance let them use twohanded weapons effectively while lonely trips. Of course they are not doing as much quick damage as champions but they are still deadly, wielding a big weapon in their hands and less likely to die as i.e. champions

It is not an easy class to guide. You can never fall asleep during fellowship tasks as ranged classes can. You have to always stay on alert and see the whole fight in order to keep those bowmen and guitar-men alive.

Good stuff. It's always nice to read peoples perceptions of their characters. I am very interested to hear if your opinions change when leveling upwards.

Couple of questions though: Do you find it useful to pull with a bow? I mean if there are more than one mob. I've seen too many times that when a guardian pulls, let's say, a pack of 3 mobs with a bow.. then usually all but the players with most discipline have attacked the mobs before you can get them at your grasp. Even though you stress teammates that they should let you get the aggro, I find it working better when the guardian just runs in the midst of the mobs and makes a couple of quick attacks.

Secondly, you really neglect Fate completely? I know I was disappointed with the way Fate worked initially, but later on when I focused more to it, I find it definitely benefits me. If you have to choose between gear that has in-combat regeneration and Fate, it's usually better to choose the one with in-combat regeneration. Nevertheless, I find Fate good to be in the backround. I have seen the exact numbers how each works, but can't find them right now.

Good thing about this game is that there are no "failed builds", because there's always the chance to respec.

Thopor wrote:

You can never fall asleep during fellowship tasks as ranged classes can. You have to always stay on alert and see the whole fight in order to keep those bowmen and guitar-men alive.

This may be true in mid-levels, but you'll come to see that in tougher places NO-ONE can fall asleep. When the battle is long, power is low on most chars. This being the case, you should never underestimate kill-speed (or well organized team-work).

Mick wrote:

Couple of questions though: Do you find it useful to pull with a bow? I mean if there are more than one mob. I've seen too many times that when a guardian pulls, let's say, a pack of 3 mobs with a bow.. then usually all but the players with most discipline have attacked the mobs before you can get them at your grasp. Even though you stress teammates that they should let you get the aggro, I find it working better when the guardian just runs in the midst of the mobs and makes a couple of quick attacks.

I think it's a question of choice. Both pulling and running work the same if (as you know) the party has strong hearts and discipline.

Mick wrote:

Thopor wrote:

You can never fall asleep during fellowship tasks as ranged classes can. You have to always stay on alert and see the whole fight in order to keep those bowmen and guitar-men alive.

This may be true in mid-levels, but you'll come to see that in tougher places NO-ONE can fall asleep. When the battle is long, power is low on most chars. This being the case, you should never underestimate kill-speed (or well organized team-work).

I know what you mean but I'm talking from the perspective of experienced MMO warrior player and I doubt there's the difference at high end levels in LOTRO.

Mick wrote:

Secondly, you really neglect Fate completely? I know I was disappointed with the way Fate worked initially, but later on when I focused more to it, I find it definitely benefits me. If you have to choose between gear that has in-combat regeneration and Fate, it's usually better to choose the one with in-combat regeneration. Nevertheless, I find Fate good to be in the backround. I have seen the exact numbers how each works, but can't find them right now.

Okay, guess I wasn't clear enough on this:

Surely it is useful to have as much fate as possible, and I surely like 10,000 of it. But since I have to choose what attributes my gear shall have, fate may not be a criteria at all. You will get plenty of fate from various items and traits anyways during your travels, e.g. +20 from the dwarf race trait (compensates your race penalty) and e.g. a pocket item that I currently use, along with some items that have might+fate or vitality+fate.

I would thing that I have quite alot of fate for a dwarf of my level (110 compared to my 160 might/vitality) despite not "wanting" it, and of course it is a nice addition. But it's surely not helpful to neglect any other attribute for it. Especially after I found that regeneration items increase your regeneration much more - though this is more a general feeling than engineering investigation, I do not have numbers and would gladly have a peek into some if you find them again.

Well there's this one thread in the yankee forums:
Fate vs Power Regeneration in Combat

And a small clip of that:

Knowledgeable Yank wrote:

Roughly 55 fate gives you 1 Power/sec in combat. So your having 3.2 Power regen in combat is equivalent to some 165++ fate, in terms of power regen alone. Of course, you are trading off tactical crit and morale regen. However, I find it unlikely that you could replace that 3.2 power with anything that even comes close to 150 fate.

So yea, pretty much varifies what we already established here. Power/Morale reg is much more efficient, but Fate adds to both of them and to tactical crits. I have Power reg in weapon and in both bracelets, just to ensure functionality in longer fights. But this is in the case of the captain, as I need both morale and power reg, and also tactical crits (power being clearly the biggest issue). Obviously Morale reg is most important to a tank, and if you don't issues with power, you should surely concentrate to in-combat morale regen gear.

Thanks for the link, it's an interesting read from the view of minstrels. Though these surely mostly care for in-combat power regeneration, I assume that the in-combat morale regeneration works alike. Fate's bonus for tactical criticals bonus I cannot really explain, but I wouldn't think it matters to a guardian anyways since damage dealing is one of our lesser concerns.

Another important statement in that remote thread was that obviously minstrels love a tank who possesses a decent amount of in-combat morale regeneration. Point proven, thanks.

The tactical skills are mostly heals, cries and things of that nature... so yes, a guardian doesn't really need to have big tactical crit %. Seeing the numbers once again really proves how important good gear really is. In-combat reg gear that is.

For a guardian the most important attributes really seem to be Might and in-combat regeneration (and armour value ofc), with vitality looming third. Of course you need some sort of morale base for the regeneration to matter. Seems weird that you really can (almost) neglect Fate and Will, and you should avoid Agility. I'm jealous, as a captain I need all of those!

Good stuff, keep us informed when you level up.


---------- And to summarize: ----------

27 Fate
=
0.5 in-combat Power reg AND
0.5 in-combat Morale reg

----------

Something to keep in mind when choosing gear, people.

In my opinion the most important are vitality and might.
Guardian has few skills which regenerate his power (health too).

Honestly speaking it happened to me once or twice that I run out of power and that's it. However I had a blue bottle and it was enough, becaue in a while I could use my power regeneration skills again. Even if I didn't have a bottle I was able to survive (thanks to high vitality and armour points) until skill cooldown is over.

So, I think fate is not important.

Mick wrote:

I'm jealous, as a captain I need all of those!

No need to be jealous, afterall you are kinda jack-of-all-trades which makes you most versatile - and, from having tried it out myself, possibly have a way more diverse fun than a guardian can ever dream of.

We need to specialize since we're only good at one thing really, and might/vitality are all that is required for it. This disallows for using mixed gear, making many of the items in the world useless, e.g. most crafted heavy armor sets I saw have a mix of bonuses across all attributes which doesn't do a guardian much good (but will perfectly suit a captain's need!). I always have to try to get ahold of yet another drop to upgrade certain armor pieces that e.g. only can get crafted with agility or will, which a guardian has no use for. So, in my view, your "I need it all" is more a "I can use it all" and rather beneficial.

The guardian's limitation to very few attribute bonuses probably is one of the prices to pay for being outstandingly efficient at the front. Once a while I miss a bit of a change in possibilities though, but the feeling of reponsibility that rests upon our shoulders makes up for it usually.

Tigrim wrote:

Mick wrote:

I'm jealous, as a captain I need all of those!

.. in my view, your "I need it all" is more a "I can use it all" and rather beneficial.

And I was on a perfectly good rant already and feeling sorry for myself, and you turned it into something positive.

WHATTA HELL IS THAT ?!!

Do you still think you should avoid agility? Even the epic guardian class armour set has agility in it, and come to think of it, in fellowship quests you have plenty of mobs hitting you (if the fellowship knows what it's doing). So many in fact, that it would be beneficial if some of those missed a couple of attacks.

Mick wrote:

Do you still think you should avoid agility? Even the epic guardian class armour set has agility in it, and come to think of it, in fellowship quests you have plenty of mobs hitting you (if the fellowship knows what it's doing). So many in fact, that it would be beneficial if some of those missed a couple of attacks.

You can't have everything Mick.
Guardians need vitality, armour, vitality, armour, might and... whatever next. You have to specify in one direction or you will be good in nothing.
In spite of that guardians have several abilities to avoid mobs hits i.e. evades, parries and blocks.

Thopor wrote:

You can't have everything Mick.
Guardians need vitality, armour, vitality, armour, might and... whatever next. You have to specify in one direction or you will be good in nothing.
In spite of that guardians have several abilities to avoid mobs hits i.e. evades, parries and blocks.

I am fully aware you have to choose which attributes you want to concentrate on, but what I'm asking is will you AVOID agility? For example:

Helm A has +10 might, +10 vitality, +10 agility.
Helm B has +10 might, +10 vitality.

Which will you choose?

Tigrim wrote:

And we don't want to evade blows anyways, 'cause most of our special attacks are of the retaliating nature, which means we need to block or parry alot to work efficiently.

This is why I'm asking.

Still gotta find out what that "Reflects a portion of damage back to the attacker" -mention in gear really means.

Mick wrote:

For example:

Helm A has +10 might, +10 vitality, +10 agility.
Helm B has +10 might, +10 vitality.

Which will you choose?

.

That is hard question, really.
Afterall I think I'd choose Helm A.

Mick wrote:

Helm A has +10 might, +10 vitality, +10 agility.
Helm B has +10 might, +10 vitality.

Which will you choose?

If I had to choose, I probably would go for the agility add-on, since a guardian cannot stack up alot of agility anyways due to the focus on other attributes. Afterall, we must make sure to not have too much of it, else our blocking/parrying counter-attacks will not work.

And without such we could e.g. not use our (limited) self-healing, power regeneration from blocking/parrying, round-house swings, etc. but instead only use our really weak standard bashing. But it is right those special attacks that cause alot of aggro and makes us keep the mobs after us and not the healer/hunter/whoever, thus we must make sure to not avoid too many incoming hits.

Of course there's limits of usefulness of avoiding agility, depending on your combat style. Myself, I love to have alot of enemies around me (3-5 of almost same level), which usually triggger my about 23% blocking chance almost all the time - not only more often than I can use them due to swing speed, but quite regularely also more often than the cooldowns on my special attacks allow. So, in the case of having alot of enemies, my agility currently seems less that required for my special attacks, which is why I could use little more. But.. this is only due to myself liking tough fights, and some guardians who e.g. prefer 1-3 enemies at a time only will need alot less agility to be efficient. In the end, it all boils down to the risk you like to take (more agility = more safety) versus your usefulness in a group (less agility = more usefulness).

On the other hand, if I had both helmets, I probably would use the one without agility and give the one with agility to a captain or champion friend, since the difference doesnt matter much to me.

Mick wrote:

Still gotta find out what that "Reflects a portion of damage back to the attacker" -mention in gear really means.

Since I just found one of those bracelets, I shall try it out - though, replacing one of my beloved (and expensivly purchased!) bracelets will sacrifice alot. But... my hope is that since a guardian usually is right in a crowd of mobs and thus receives alot of hits, the reflected damage on each of these hits actually might visibly increase my total (usually low) dps. For this testing purpose I will not sell the ring (despite it possibly selling well) and will report how my test goes.

Tigrim wrote:

In the end, it all boils down to the risk you like to take (more agility = more safety) versus your usefulness in a group (less agility = more usefulness).

You're probably right. Less agility means more blows on you, which puts more stress on the minstrel. BUT if less agility means that more aggro management and thus keeping the mobs from hitting anyone else, it's also easier for the minstrel.

In other words you'd like more agility in solo play (to certain degree), and less in fellowships.

Mick wrote:

Still gotta find out what that "Reflects a portion of damage back to the attacker" -mention in gear really means.

Here goes my testing result, though it doesn't quite fit into this topic:

I used a single bracelet with the reflection property and found a fixed reflection damage of 3 - no matter how hard the enemy hit me - at about 20% chance. This surely isn't worth anything unless you use a full set of such gear (which would weaken you alot in all other areas).

In the end, this attribute seems not worth using at all.

Possibly the testing result will change when using a higher level item, my bracelet was level 31. This would be interesting to know, since it could change the overall usability to the better.

Shame to admit it but honestly speaking I have no idea how to use Summoon a Tinker skill Any suggestions? What conditions do I have to meet? Campfire or something?

Thopor wrote:

Shame to admit it but honestly speaking I have no idea how to use Summoon a Tinker skill Any suggestions? What conditions do I have to meet? Campfire or something?

Yes, all you need is a campfire. (not sure if there was something else needed, like some rations or something)